Monday, April 27, 2009

Economic Times

"You cannot strengthen the weak by weakening the strong. You cannot help the small men by tearing down the big men.

You cannot help the poor by destroying the rich. You cannot lift the wage earner up by pulling down the wage payer.

You cannot keep out of trouble by spending more than your income. You cannot further the brotherhood of man by inciting class hatreds.

You cannot establish security on borrowed money. You cannot build character and courage by taking away man’s initiative and independence.

You cannot help men permanently by doing for them what they could and should do for themselves"

attributed to Abraham Lincoln

Pic: Small town America. Hot Springs, NC.


Sonya Walker said...

hey guess what. I cant rememeber my password or even my url on here. If you would be so kind as to send me the name of my url I might could log on. And you think YOU'RE getting old.
love ya sis-Sonya

Shopgirl said...

Glad you posted, I have missed you.
I do not agree with this statement.
Greed has almost taken this country and a few others to it's knee's. We have been working for less and the rich keep getting richer. And if they decide that they are not making enough here, they will go where they can pay poor people less than a dollar a day. If the man at the top of this food chain cared about the people, he would not take from us, he would give us what we need to live on. Their bottom line is about them not us. If you are rich and your company is making you alot of money, why would you be giving less to the man that makes you rich. Everyone wants the dream, and look what happened when they reached out for it, it was a lie, and now we have a mess.

Rebecca said...

Hi Carrie,
I do agree with this statement. Give a man a fish he will eat for a day. Teach a man to fish and he will eat for a lifetime.

Carrie J said...

Isn't it great that we live in a place where we are free to disagree and express our opinion?

I see where you are coming from Mary. But IMO that comes down to the responsibility of the business owner to do what is right.
We have the freedom to not buy things from businesses who are not responsible enough to pay their workers fair wages.
Don't buy things from these companies. IMO the consumer has responsibility as well. We need to spend our money in a way that shows we don't support such practices.

People will say "Everything is made overseas. We can't buy anything!" That isn't true. It is harder but not impossible.

I agree that some businesses just keep growing and building with no end in sight and appear to do nothing to help the "little" man. But there are others who are very responsible and help in many different ways.

In a Utopian society people would always have the best interest of everyone at heart. It has never been that way and never will.
One of the reasons I choose to work for myself is because of some of the horrible people I've worked for in the past. I give up a lot of security to do it but it is worth it to me.

If the system that businesses have to operate was not so burdensome I might consider expanding and providing more jobs. But for someone like me who isn't interested in being the next Bill Gates it is easier and more prudent to remain small. I couldn't afford to financially handle the requirements that the government would place on me. Nor do I want the headaches involved in running a larger business.

So, I agree with the statement that we can't lift the wage earner by tearing down the wage payer.
We just need to make sure that regulation is in place to prevent those who are less than noble in their actions are prevented from doing harm.

Shopgirl said...

Carrie, it is good that we have a voice...I think what upsets me most is that while I believe that no one gets a free ride, I just find that the people that work the hardest get the least.
Maybe not in my time, but I believe it is coming....the problems of today and yesterday will and are give us so little that it will become like the Romans of old. Look what is happening because of greed, even with insurance you will have thousands of dollars owing after a surgery. College degree's are not getting people a job. If you do not have a job, and you lose your home, do you blame the person who lost his job and lost his home, Our last president gave the green light to buying homes that were not afordable. And ask people to buy instead of renting. Wages were going down over the past 8 years. I guess what I am saying is we are victims of our own government, that we were asleep while things were being done that has brought us to this. My Grandparents were victims of greed in the 30's. They lost their farm to the bank because they had no money to pay the tax's. And people profit on the backs of the working man. If you can't sell your product because no one has the money, what will happen over time to us.
I think we both have some good points. I wish we had the answers.
It is very hard to find made in the USA...even food is hard to find from here. My husband has always bought USA tools, and now you can't find them unless they are used. We are selling out as a nation. I am a pain in the butt.

Big Hugs, Mary

Carrie J said...

No you are NOT a pain in the butt! LOL. I enjoy a good discussion with people who disagree with me. I never learned anything from people who always agree with me!

This discussion could go on forever and take up much more space than we have here. I just want to address a couple of points. Maybe I should write a post instead but anyway.
Redlining (which basically forced loans) was a product of the democrats in congress I believe. The President had to sign the bill yes. I'll have to go back and refresh my memory as to what the particulars are.

My grandparents lost all the money they had in the bank during the depression and ended up boarding a school teacher (food, housing and laundry) for $10 a month. My grandmother sold eggs and butter and they lived the most frugal life I have ever known anyone to live. They continued to live like that until they died.

I have a dress that my grandmother kept to work in the yard and garden in. It literally has patches on patches. I kept it just to remind me.

In the days past if a person became sick, they died. It was as simple as that. People did without health care for many reasons. It still happens all over the world. I agree that health care should be available to everyone. It could be.
It is such a massive issue that I don't think that it can or will be fixed. Socialized medicine might work for awhile but it will bog down unless they start at the ground level and take it all away from the private sector. That would be wrong too.

Here in Tennessee we have had a state insurance that has gone through all sorts of changes and is still in trouble. It simply doesn't work on so many levels. People have died waiting for treatment or have been denied medication and treatment they need.

I buy everything I can on the secondary market. I don't buy new if I can help it. I try to buy American made or at least from a company that I consider responsible. You are right, it is really hard to do.
Food wise I have started buying my meat and eggs from local farmers.

If you want a really good book about eating local check out Barbara Kinsolver's book "Animal, Vegetable, Miracle." I cannot recommend it enough. Excellent book.

Well, I have to go be a capitalist and produce some goods for the market place! Lol.
Take Care,


Shopgirl said...

I don't have all the answers, I just have feelings. I just know that even with really good insurence we will still ow thousands when Arney has his knee surgery Wed. He can hardly walk. If we had no insurence the man would be out of luck, and have to live in pain.
I guess that I am a bet of a PollyAnna when it comes to what I think is fair for everyone.
I believe we all deserve a better life, a feeling that we matter instead of being a number without a face. I have hope that this young new President cares as much as I think he does.
I don't know much about the east. I am a California girl living in Idaho. Now there is a subject to stay away from.
Your point of view is valid, and I respect this debate, but like you, I think we need to let it go. Idea's and Ideals are to be treasured, and that we care makes us good people. Anything that makes us think about the really important things. I am blessed to have all that I need and more.
I hope you are doing well with your own business. It is so good that you can work at home.
Enough of this....
Tell about Tennessee, I would love to know about your town and so on.
take care of you, Love
Thank You! Mary